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Re: Hmmm, nice spike!
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Posted by Vigge [Email] (more from Vigge) on Thu, 16 Dec 2004 12:22:59 Share Post by Email
In Reply to: Re: Hmmm, nice spike!, perkj, Wed, 15 Dec 2004 14:50:38
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"But what does the spike do in favour of the driver?"

Simple, increase power as the dyno grach shows, did you not see the dyno graph?

"This is odd behaivour."
More boost = increae in HP....yeah this is odd. How on earth is this odd?

A spike is not = more boost, since it only appers for a very short time. To be clear I only speak of the spike not the whole curve. But since you're finally commenting on this issue, tell me how many data points does that curve have in it? To me it seems that the spike is the third point? Do you actually know what happen between point, I dont think so and You're reffering to the curve as "real measurement". I may be only guessing, but the spik could be even higher in real life. I cant say this is the case, but it is a possibility. Only you can provide the extra data, but I dont think it neccessary, since this grapgh already showes that boost does spike. You said that you have a friend who is very into tuning, ask his comments about boost spikes. I bet it wont add up with your comment, but ask. Maybe ask a second person to analyze that boost plot for you, somebody who tunes cars for living I would recommend.

I could ask you does T7 spike stock? Nope, why? "Uncontrolled" ups and down are never good for any control system. You still stay behind your commment that spikes are not odd behivour?



"Lets see the ingition timing, since you seem to have it?"
Would be interesting to see, but why?!?! The dyno graph shows an increace in both torque and hp over the entire graph...if there was a dip in either under the stock numbers I would agree that this would be necessary, but in this case why? Your making more hp and torque over the entire graph...who cares what the ignition timing is. "

This once again is one of those statements, that has no informative value for any of us what so ever. You quote data, but once asked for it you wont provide it. One can draw conclusions that you dont have the data or it has some downsides.

"Secondly what about the difference in high rpm A/F? No adaption there, why?"
So long as the A/f ratio is between 12 and 14 who cares? What are you looking to prove? Looking at the graph, at high RPM the stock pretty much matches with the downpipe.

Ask your tuning frind about high rpm A/F under WOT. Basically you're saying that more power with leaner A/F is good? Real nice... What about tendency to knock does it go up or down with leaner A/F? In this case adding your DP will lower the safety margin and make the engine more tendent to knock.

"
What are you trying to disprove solid data....you asked for solid data in other posts to prove HP gains with HW mods only. Here you go, you got it and now your trying to disprove actual data.....think about Vigge, you're not doing much for you credability here. How many dyno runs do you need to see showing increase before you will agree that HW mods only can increase HP?

Yes this is data alraight you basically it adds up relativey well with my orinal arguments how T7 reacts to HW parts. We got "ower shooting here" and leaning A/F.

"There is plenty of T5 data that will show this (you claimed to me before this is not just a T7 issue), Bosch ME7 data, and now we have T7 data rolling in. "

If you ever thought that I stated that T5 and T7 are alike, you are mistaking and big time. Read back "I only due this because T7 is the only control system that I'm more familiar with. Sorry, if my post indicate that the stuff that I write would only applie to T7, not my intention."

Of course the result will be different on T5, its a speed density system for crist sake. From my original post on that other thread
"The T5 system is a pure pressure related system (feels only the boost in mbar) and the intake air temp to adjust (slightly). NO CORRECTIONS TAKE PLACE IN BOOST LEVEL, so if the ECM is programmed for a target boost of 2000mbar (absolute) at a certain rpm, the ECM will control the PWM up to this boost (if reachable).
NO BOOST ADAPTION AT ALL."

With only this (my understanding of T5) you can find tons of ways to show why T5 does react a whole lot diffent to HW parts. It has no MAF, so non of the calibration issues I wrote applie to it. Where does this lead us, T7 is the topic not T5.


"and now we have T7 data rolling in. "

and what would this be?




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