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Whow, whow, whow.....I either did not present my comments well or you misunderstanding.
>>> Unfortunately, the majority of those out there with cars having over 100K do not have healthy systems.
>>I don't know that this is true, especially for Saab owners, who arguably take better care of their cars than the average SUV
owner. Further, I never said that BL would or could cause problems in poorly maintained systems, though it is possible. I'd
have to see evidence to be swayed one way or the other, and so far I've seen none.
I was speaking in generalities. As in the average car owner. The average car owner does not own a Saab, Jaguar or Corvette.
>> My 89 Saab made it 149K with no Bar's leak.
>>Also, no one said that you HAD to use BL. It does seal well and conditions the cooling system, and I feel that it is a very
effective and inexpensive fix for the ubiquitous Saab heater-core maladies. A well-maintained system will last for many
thousands of miles, but may last longer with BL added.
Conceeded... :-)
>> Just because a few of you have had no problems with it in HEALTHY systems does not mean the average Joe would not
have a problem.
>>You are speculating without evidence to support it. Provide evidence that BL causes problems in healthy or unhealthy
systems and I'll be the first person in line as your audience. I honestly have no irrational allegiances here. If BL is ever
empirically proven to be ineffective or inadvisable as an additive, I'll be the first to remove it from my car.
Again, obviously spoken in generalities. I personally have not seen any empirical evidence that it does work. Common sence, says it should help stops leaks. I only question the consequences.
>> A few years ago I used some of the Prestone stuff. Just happen to be the silver garbage.
>>I use the "silver garbage," if you're referring to Prestone's extended- life coolant, and have had no problem in over one year
since installed. From the research I've done it is a fine product, and have heard nothing to make me think otherwise.
No, the flakey stop leak stuff. It looks like aluminum flakes.
>> A few month's later the head gasket failed while under high boost(Mitsubishi Starion).
>>Please! Do you really think you can point a finger at the coolant because you had a head gasket go bad months later while you
were subjecting the turbo to high stress? Has it occurred to you that perhaps the head gasket just *might* have gone out
regardless of your antifreeze choice? I can't believe I'm hearing this. It also rained in Peoria on the same date, so why not
blame that event on your head-gasket maladies?
No, and to be honest I take offense at this attack. I was only trying to provide some background without being overly length in my post. The car had nearly 130K on it. On the second head and a stock style gasket. The water passage on the back of the 4G63 is very near the outside of the head gasket. The gasket is know to give way in this region. I added that the car was under high boost accelerating the failure. The stock 3 valve head on the 4G63 is know for it's failures.
To reinterate. The stop leak had nothing to do with the failure. I was trying to lay a timeline and why I went to great lengths inspecting the piping.
>> I used the timing to fully redo the engine and turbo. You could clearly see that ~1/4 of the diameter of the piping feeding
the turbo was clogged by natural corrosion. The remaining diameter clearly was the silver stop leak.
>Geez. You put the "silver garbage" in your system, then in three months you removed a few engine parts and discovered
corrosion. Has it occurred to you that perhaps the previous coolant might have contributed in some way to that corrosion?
Exactly. The original corrosion was present at the introduction of the stop leak flakey stuff. The silver colored residue was layered on top of the normal corrosion.
>What is the history of the car?
Hopefully, I have expounded earlier but for further details e-mail me. I doubt going further here will benefit anyone. To note, I have seen this on several turbocharged cars but rarely see this kind of problem on NA cars. I believe largely due to the larger passages or lack of small piping leading to the turbo. Here is my website for my Starions and Conquests: http://sites.netscape.net/scottsstarquests/
Don't be overly critic. ;-)
>>If these parts were corroded before installing the Prestone, it wouldn't surprise me that they
would remain so a few months later.
Again I agree. This is exactly my point. I would never conclude that a stop leak would remove corrosion. Besides I would prefer that it not be floating around in my new coolant.
>>> Does that mean only the silver flake stuff is bad. I don't know, but the silver stuff is easily identifiable.
>>I don't know either, but you've provided no evidence to suggest that it has. What do you mean "the silver stuff is easily
ideitifiable"? Did it leave fingerprints? How do you know the corrosion was caused by the recently installed coolant?
I don't see the point in taunting me here, but again, it's bright silver in color. Viewable with the naked eye. It apparantly retains it's color.
>>> The pellet Bars leak stuff could easily look like natural corrosion.
>>You're right about that if you refer to the coolant color and appearance. BL makes coolant look aweful. However, BL will
not coat a metal surface, as it doesn't work in that manner. Did you use BL with the Prestone? You aren't being very specific
about what you did and when, and what the previous history of the car's cooling-system maintenance has been.
No, I was hoping to dismiss this topic. I doubted it would make much difference. I will hereby disallow myself from posting on any Stop Leak Posts!
>>> I frequent alot of other boards and I have never seen such staunch admiration of a product. To all future readers: "Beware
questioning Bar's Leak on the Saab Boards!"
>>Go check out discussions among Jaguar owners. Over a year ago I posted my experience with BL and others contributed with
similar stories. It has been discussed quite a bit here, but I don't think anyone is going to attack you or anyone else if you
provide ample evidence to support your arguments. Do you expect us to believe that BL and/or Prestone coolant are inferior
products or are in any way suspect based on the evidence you've provided?
No, only posting my observations. I have trusted you guys and introduced the Bar's Leak to my Saab. I only introduced it in moderation.
>>I'm interested in keeping my prized possession running well for many years, and I consult this board frequently because I get
answers that I can't get anywhere else from a variety of people who have used many different products. Not everyone will
always agree with the next person who posts, but we share our experiences, usually in a civil way, and try to learn from their
experiences. It is an invaluable resource.
Hmmmm.....
>>I push a few products with a fervor because I have found them exceptionally useful in the Saab 9K environment. BL is one of
these products. The jury's still out on the extended-life Prestone, but nothing I've heard so far has given me cause to change
my mind on it.
I like the Prestone Anti-freeze just fine.
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